TODAY'S GUEST: Allen Silver, sacred intimate and adult film performer

I'm extremely happy to welcome Allen Silver to Hard Conversations!

Allen Silver resides in San Francisco. He's a sacred intimate, certified massage therapist, adult film performer, and conscious sex worker, 

Allen has extensive experience participating and assisting in numerous workshops offered by Body Electric School where he trained as a Sacred Intimate. Among other things, he is a skilled flogger and spanker.

Allen describes himself as a "sensitive" boy growing up, “who would rather bake cakes than play football, something that young men in West Texas just didn't do.” He followed his own path, and takes great pride in his life as a sacred intimate where he is able to actualize and explore his gift of healing.

• WEBSITE:

  https://allensi.com/

  https://www.pornhub.com/pornstar/allen-silver. (contains explicit content)

YOU'LL LEARN

• Penile injections get used by lots of porn stars

• Sacred Intimacy is a fantastic field of sex work

• You don’t have to have a hard penis to have fun

• Some guys make porn moves during sex that isn’t enjoyable for their partners

• Practical tips you can try at home

• The upside and downside of Viagra

• Insights on sexuality

• Breathing can be very important to sexual enjoyment

• The importance of sexual play and finding the thing that brings you joy in enjoying sex

• Three things make good sex

• And more!

THANK YOU FOR LISTENING to my male sexuality and sex therapy podcast!

To get more hard conversations sent directly to your device as episodes become available, you can subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher!

Also, reviews on iTunes are extremely helpful and greatly appreciated! I read each and every one of them, and feel free to share your URL there so I can contact you later on and say thanks!

And lastly, if you have any questions (or would like answers to previously submitted voicemail questions!), head on over to Tim’s website.

About the Show

Introducing Hard Conversations, a podcast about male sexuality, and all things erectile, from the latest natural erectile dysfunction treatment to the best ed medical treatment. Therapist Tim Norton expands the conversation about male sexuality, adds context to why we struggle as a society to have hard conversations and breaks down how in a sex-positive environment there really is no room for taboos, judgment, or shame when it comes to penises.

YOUR online sex therapy and couple’s therapy HOST:

Tim Norton is a sex positive sex therapist working in private practice. He offers online therapy, online sex therapy, online sex coaching, and therapy and coaching for somatic symptom disorder.

Tim obtained his bachelor’s and master’s degrees from the University of Southern California. Tim is a proud member of American Association of Sex Counselors, Educators, and Therapists (AASECT), the Los Angeles Sexological Association, and works part-time with the Pain Psychology Center in Beverly Hills.

Hard Conversations Podcast Transcript

Tim Norton: hello and welcome to hard conversations. I'm really excited about my next guest, Allen Silver, who resides in San Francisco. He's a sacred, intimate, certified massage therapist, adult film, performer. And,  anything else that I left out there? 

Allen Silver: Oh, I'd like to say conscious sex worker, 

Tim Norton: conscious sex work. Okay. So I think there are a few things there that not, I mean, everybody knows what a massage therapist is.

 but I don't know if we know what a conscious sexual worker is in a, in a sacred, intimate is 

Allen Silver: sure. Well,  my approach,  my [00:01:00] reason for getting into this was because it was a calling for me. So a lot of people get into some version of sex work because,  they want to make money or,  they think, you know, it'll validate them in some way or some other reason maybe they're coerced into it.

But for me, it came from a deep place of needing to be useful. Okay.  so the modality that fits me most in that is a sacred, intimate. 

Tim Norton: Okay. And can you tell me a little bit more about what a, what a sacred intimate actually is? Sure. 

Allen Silver: So th th that's a term that was coined by the body electric school.  Joe Kramer came up with that and,  different people have different definitions for sacred, intimate, but I will tell you what mine is.

It's a,   a conscious sex worker, someone who does erotic healing work with an intentionality connected to it. So sometimes I like to say,  Sacred into the SIS is also a specific intention. So that means someone comes to you with an [00:02:00] intention around,  something. They want to explore something, they need healing around something maybe they're afraid of.

 and you're,  being allowed to trust from that person when you go into that session, as opposed to trading sex for money, which is what we traditionally think of when we think of sex workers. 

Tim Norton: Okay. And I get the sense. So you, you started that later in life, or how long have you been doing sacred intimate work?

Allen Silver:  almost 18 years now.  yeah.  I came into it,  via some workshops I did through the body electric school.  and it just so resonated with me that it ended up being my life's calling. 

Tim Norton: Oh, that's really cool. And so. You know the name of the show or the theme of the show has a lot to do with erectile issues.

So why don't we just go ahead and dive right into that? Because I, when I was reading about you, I was thinking along the lines of, well, you might be working with erectile issues [00:03:00] as someone on an adult film sets,  someone who has sexual partners and someone who's a sacred intimate. So. Of those avenues or any other ones that we haven't covered here.

Where do you think you've learned most about how to deal with,  either your own erectile issues, if they've ever been an issue or with others of other clients or other, other actors? 

Allen Silver: Well,  so completely different worlds,  in terms of dealing with,  sexual and what are we saying? Sorry. Erectile issues, right.

Thank you for saying erectile issues. I just hate erectile dysfunction is the worst, because I mean, I think the penis has wisdom, you know, if we listen, so, you know, it's not. Dysfunctional something's happened.  but,  I'm digressing, you asked about those barriers, various places and how,   regular issues come into play.

So completely different worlds. The porn world,  adult video, that's all [00:04:00] about putting on a show and,  hopefully sneaking in some genuine connection and passion and, and all the good stuff we really want to have important as opposed to working one-on-one with somebody.  In which case we're, it's a different approach.

 should I keep going about that? 

Tim Norton: Okay. So does it ever happen? Well, how long have you been doing it? Yeah, 

Allen Silver: they actually started that later.  so,  but a long time,  probably 15, 17 years ago as well.   I'm 57 now I started,  I think I, one of was 40 and,  What was the 

Tim Norton: question? Okay. Ha that's. So you've been doing porn.

I always ask about,  people's relationship to porn with respect to Viagra. So Viagra was only a couple of years old when you just got started. Was it all, was it already ubiquitous on sets or did it take awhile or is it [00:05:00] even ubiquitous on sets? I don't even know. Is it something that guys are just always taking.

Allen Silver: Oh, sure. Well,  most guys are,   not everybody,  you know, and there's, there's,  other,  erectile medications apart from that.  so, you know, it's in on a porn site, it's about,  you know,  performing and looking a certain way and, and turning to the camera at times. And,  so. Yeah, that's a different,  place,  held an erection in,  other porn situation very differently than I would in a sacred intimate session.

Tim Norton: Okay. Do you guys have erectile issues on porn sets? 

Allen Silver:  yes. Yes.  but as you probably know, there are,  even stronger things than Viagra people can use on porn set. So that generally takes care of most,   hard-on issues. [00:06:00]  wait, 

Tim Norton: what's actually stronger than Viagra. 

Allen Silver: Well, like,    Caverject, say that again?

Tim Norton: Caverject with, Oh, like an injection, right? Yeah. Yes. An 

Allen Silver: injection. So, okay. So sometimes we'll use that.   but what I have seen them include in the contract sometimes is,   That you, they won't pay you if you can't,  come. And so, and I asked about that, cause it was like, I don't, I don't quite get that because that's not really always necessary for every shoot.

And,  the director told me that it was because they'd have guys who had been out partying the night before, you know, came in high or something. And you know, so when you have a mitigating mess like that going on in a set, it's gonna, it's gonna mess up your ability to get an 

Tim Norton: erection. No, definitely. Okay.

So wow. Even in the contract, huh? They were pretty strict. Yeah. I thought that was 

Allen Silver: hilarious there. I was just was like, wow. Okay. 

Tim Norton: And do you have to initial that paragraph?

[00:07:00] Okay. So, so guys are usually, but, but when you first got started in, it was there already the injections and the pills are, were guys trying other 

Allen Silver: things.  I didn't know about all that at the beginning.   I think, I think we did have IRA at that point. So,  and as you know,  fire only,  supports,  you getting erection has nothing to do with if you're actually turned on or interested.

Right. So you still have to be 

Tim Norton: aroused. Yeah. And I don't even know that we mentioned that you're doing gay porn here that we're talking about. So when you are with other actors, are you also helping them sometimes? Do you guys help each other? If there's.  if somebody is not quite getting as hard as they want to.

Allen Silver: Yeah.  Oh God. Trying to think of the names. Charlie Daniels and Leo forte. We're off camera doing things to turn me on once [00:08:00] for a solid shoot at tight-knit. So yeah, absolutely. It's like we absolutely support each other in that situation. Okay. Yeah. And that's something we're so off to watch it got me going and it's like, okay, this stood behind the camera man.

While they were taking stills. All right. And what kind of the worst? I hate doing stills, but yeah. Oh, I bet. So interactions when you're interacting with somebody, there's something going on, you know, there's, there's something to work off of, or to react to, or to help them help you with.  but when you're just by yourself and put you cameras, that's the most challenging.

Tim Norton: Right. And so what kinds of things would they do to, to help get you turned on? Was it just like kinky? Oh, these guys, I just like watching them. They were, they have back 

Allen Silver: there. Okay. Oh, okay. Yeah, but you know, I want to say that people always ask me about, you know, Oh, well, can I be a fluffer around the set?

And you know, I have yet to see an actual flipper on a point. So

it's not 

Tim Norton: you, you just dispelled the [00:09:00] myth. Okay. Well, I'm 

Allen Silver: not saying they don't exist, but in my experience, I haven't seen it. 

Tim Norton: Right. Okay. So on a set, you, you might be with. Other actors, you might have an injection, you might use pills, but I get the sense that you wouldn't bring pills to a sacred intimacy session and say, here, take this and then we'll get started.

Allen Silver: No, no. So,  I, I have no problem with people using Viagra as a support. I just don't have any negative connotations around it. However, it's not something that,  is going to correct.  the underlying issue or help you with, you know, the reason you came in there for, or they wouldn't be coming in.  but most of my clients don't come in specifically for erectile issues.

  however,  it is something I work with them a lot around,  to get them comfortable with getting playful, to get them into a space where it's not.  as big an issue [00:10:00] and even also to help them understand that there's a hell of a lot of fun you can have without having an erection. So that's,   new information for some men.

Tim Norton: Yeah, I will. What do most of them come in for? 

Allen Silver: If people want to try something, something specific that they've, haven't had a chance to try it.  a lot of role-play,  I am very turned on with the dad boy type role play.  so I get a lot of people who come in for that kind of thing. 

Tim Norton: Okay. And then can you see them in movies too?

So clarify for the listeners, what dad, boy role-play is in your shoes. 

Allen Silver: So in this context, it's a, it's a fantasy play,  around the archetype of dad and boy, we're not talking literal dead end boy. So,  most gay men have. Things going on in their history, around how they dealt with their father. And they have a,  probably a wound around it.

[00:11:00]  they had wishes that their father had supported them as a little gay boy in ways that he probably didn't once in a while, I run across somebody who that's not the case for it, but it's extremely rare. So it can be a fun. Yeah. Can also be healing to explore that, to be the dad that wished that had that's one 

Tim Norton: option.

Okay. And I bet that's really very moving work, 

Allen Silver: but yes, I, I it's the most fulfilling thing I can imagine doing well. It really is. Yeah. That's really cool. 

Tim Norton: So back to backed off hard penises.  so does,  would you say that any, if there's any crossover, like, have you learned things from doing porn? That you actually bring into your sacred intimate work?

Allen Silver: yes.  and before we go on, I just want to say that,  [00:12:00] you don't have to have a hard penis to have fun right. All the time. But,  that I brought in from the porn. Yes. Because, 

I would say in terms of,  Because I've had that actual experience.  I can help some of these guys with their fantasies and, and guys get hung up on porn and they study the way things are done in porn,  that are maybe done more for the camera that are then for actual disengaging each other. So can you give an example?

Yeah, well, there's the whole,   turning to the camera and doing the twisty,  cock sucking thing. Like, you know, I've said guys to do this thing to me and I'm like, What are you doing? And that their favorite porn star does that. And,  I will say,  you know, that's great, but that I don't actually enjoy that.

So let's talk about what does feel good. Let's find out what feels good to you. And they might not enjoy that particular thing same [00:13:00] either.  yeah, but it just that idea. And in terms of erections,  you know, they just think you're supposed to be able to pull it out of your pants and just go.  you know, because from watching porn and I explained to him and say, no, this, if you could see how it shot, it's,  you know, it's all done very cleverly and very technically.

And,  you know, it looks like that the guy was just pulled over by the police. And one minute later they're having sex, but,  you know, it showbiz. Right. 

Tim Norton: And so, and behind the scenes, there are a lot of other things happening. Well, it's just, 

Allen Silver: it's actually very boring and in many ways, I mean, there's lots of sitting around and waiting.

And then when you get around to doing like the actual action scene,  you know, you get a chance to get ready to do that and build up to it. And then, you know, the shoot it, then it all fits into a story. Right.  but in terms of bringing anything, it's funny, I feel like I bring things to the other direction.

But bringing something from porn into the sacred, [00:14:00] intimate work, it's just that I can actually help them to understand what really goes on.  so they don't have to hold on to unrealistic fantasy so much. 

Tim Norton: Okay. And we'll then talk about,  bringing it in the other direction. So you bring sacred, intimate work into, on the porn sites.

Allen Silver: Well, in terms of,  I have,  I have a secret agenda to foster hot sex between men. It's not a secret, I suppose, but,  One of the things is just a basic thing that a sacred, intimate body electric things around connecting, and you'd be surprised how many men won't look you in the eye. So if you can coax them into looking into in the eye,  yeah, on screen,  something happens.

Something always happens and,  the connection gets a lot bigger and it gets more powerful and hotter in my opinion.  so that's one thing I do.  I also make,  an effort to,  connect with a man ahead of [00:15:00] time,  in terms of supporting him and allow him to get the chance to support me because, you know, we bet we may both be nervous and to have like a genuine human connection ahead of time,  is a 

Tim Norton: good idea.

And what might that look like? Are you talking about on the set or, or in advance of the shoot that would 

Allen Silver: say before the shoot, just, you know, Clearing the air, making sure that there's nothing,  we need to Claire there's anything that, you know,  may have inadvertently done something he's pissed off about, or,  I may accidentally have done something or maybe my breath is bad.

So,  it's,  it's  you get to drop a certain wall with that around having to be Mr. ReadyMan,  and showing your vulnerability. And then I give him a chance to,  be vulnerable too.  I don't necessarily get a big response from that, but I think it does set a nice tone, but that's an example of something that comes from the sacred into my [00:16:00] world into,  into the kicking it in to, in front of the 

Tim Norton: camera.

Okay. Okay. That's that's  that's really interesting. And then, so in your, actually your secret mission, as you say is you want to ha you want, you want the viewers to see some of these elements from sacred intimate work and to. Hopefully apply some of that when they start having the kind of sex that they're seeing on your porn.

Yeah. 

Allen Silver: That's mixed in there, man. You know, honestly, I'm a, an exhibitionist to a certain degree, so little pre-Madonna going in there. So, you know, I love to be told I'm pretty good front of the camera and, you know, get positive feedback. It feels good.  you know, just being honest.  and then you also have to just trust the director.

You know, I've had wonderful directors cause they try to create amazing stuff out of the water. Footage of that I would have thought had been terrible.  but I also think another place in which maybe some of my,  segregated [00:17:00] background comes in is in some of the times where it is,  akin to role-play,    dad in a joke, age movies.

And,  you know, I can really get down to that energy that,  that place of being the loving dad, he's there to support son. Okay. 

Tim Norton: So. Earlier, you said you were,  a conscious sex worker. Is that kind of the same as a sacred, intimate, or is that, are those two different 

Allen Silver: things? Just throw that in there because people don't necessarily would know what a,  a sacred intimate is.

And that one's a little more like you can kind of figure that, that label out by yourself to the most degree. But I also like to say it because,  there are an awful lot of guys who just do,  some form of sex work because they need to pay the bills.  or, you know, cause, Oh, well everyone tells me I should and et cetera.

And that's absolutely not the place I'm coming from. I have this agenda and desire to be useful. And I found the way for me [00:18:00] to be useful is to use my whole body. And that includes my cock and my brain. 

Tim Norton: Okay.  so you, you said you were taking classes at the body electric? 

Allen Silver: Yeah. The bunny electric school is a school that,  started in Berkeley in the eighties.

It came out in response to.  the AIDS crisis and they created this amazing set of classes.  Joe Kramer created this thing and,  they were helping men who were basically traumatized and terrified at the time,  sex equals death for awhile. And so,  they helped them to connect in a,  safe, sexual and spiritual way,  using things like Reiki and breathing techniques.

And. Dallas erotic massage and a bunch of other really cool stuff. Hmm. Yeah. I had a, I took a win a workshop with them while I was on vacation in Hawaii. And,  it was a pivotal point in my life,  because [00:19:00] I'd never been exposed to that. And all of a sudden there was this big, big world, big erotic world.

I didn't have an inkling of as a boy from West Texas. So that sent me on a new trajectory. 

Tim Norton: Hmm, that sounds like a good trip to take. 

Allen Silver: It depends on your point of view. My ex was not thrilled about it. One party electric did to me. 

Tim Norton: Yeah. So you, you mentioned something like, so Reiki in breath techniques. So I would imagine that could really affect,  sexuality and intercourse and penises and everything like that.

Could you tell us a little bit more about how you incorporate that into sex? 

Allen Silver: I don't use a whole lot of that. Probably electric does mainly just because I'm lazy, but it's a kind of a,  a way of doing a,  Putting your body in a, in a very, as a short term, altered state through a breathing technique.  and it's [00:20:00] one of those ways that you can have like a, almost like a mini shamonic experience.

Like every, every, each amount of type experience is about knocking yourself out of your room, normal bubble, getting a different point of view and then coming back. And this is like a really minimal way to do that.  So yeah. In terms of erections it's it's in fact in that situation, erections are irrelevant.

Yeah. Because that's one of the beauty, beautiful things that body electric did is they taught me to have these awesome erotic experiences that weren't about having a boner. 

Tim Norton: Okay. So then when you're in this altered state, Is this something that you're doing with a partner or is it like a solo sex situation?

I need to go do one of these. I do.

Yeah. 

Allen Silver: It's very, very well-described,   plan it's it's in a group and,  I don't want to give you too many details about it because, [00:21:00] you know, go do it and experience it, but it's done an absolutely safe, respectful,  Beautiful container,  in such a way that you were allowed to just have your experience, whatever it is, and not,  feeling like there's any sheds attached to it about how you should be feeling or what you should be doing.

Tim Norton: Okay. That sounds really nice. Yeah. So, so what are some of the other things that you you do with clients that you find that are, is really helpful for them to learn about their sexuality? 

Allen Silver: Well,  I, I really want to get people connected with what really turns them on and what's what is real for them and not what they think they should be doing.

 that that can be challenging.  I'll tell you the way that I approach that is,  wiggling around again, is that I,  in a way I almost kind of trick them into,  [00:22:00] finding their playful self. Like that's, what I love to do is going to a playful place with guys. And,  because I have this belief that there's,  an unspoiled inner core in there, no matter what screwed up stuff has happened to you, it's in there.

And,  if we can just tap into that a little bit, we're going to get some insight. And,  an example of that is too.  I've had guys come to me who,  for example, couldn't,  ejaculate in front of another person, or they may have been concerned about interaction, but in either case the same kind of approach that we take in which I find a way to,  play with them,  get them to,  drop their guard and be in a safe place with me.

 it's very important that I can take, create a container of trust with the person. So it's a confidential space.  they get permission to be as messy or as weird or stupid as they want to be inside that space. And no one else is ever going to know what happens inside there. I don't tell them, but, [00:23:00]  working with somebody who has an issue around ejaculating in front of another person, or,  having a boner, I,  get them to a playful space hopefully, and they forget about that part.

And then lo and behold, it happens if that's what's appropriate to happen. And sometimes it isn't appropriate what to happen, but they've let go of that. Need to have,  

Tim Norton: an erection. Okay. The need to have an erection. Cause they're, it's like they're controlling the erection or they're really kind of clenching.

And does the play relax them or what's your take on it? 

Allen Silver: Ticket is such a direct physical thing is more,   their, their intellectual self and their,  uptight adult self is getting in the way. Of what is really play for them. Right. So that's, my job is to get that crap out of the way and we'll see what happens.

Yeah. And they're, 

Tim Norton: they're just letting go of yeah. That uptight [00:24:00] adult self. Yeah. 

Allen Silver: It's funny. I, I avoid using words like uptight, because I think when you say things like it's, for example, telling someone to relax actually makes them more tense because now they're efforting to relax. Right. But yeah, you're right.

Uptight would be a way to say it.  Yeah, I would say, I want to get them into a free-flowing loose playful space,  try to evoke,  what they were when they first started exploring their sexuality to that kind of Headspace. That's a, that's a fun place to visit. 

Tim Norton: Yeah. And you know what the w w in, in sex therapy terms, you know, we'll call that it's something like delayed ejaculation.

And, and they, there are no big studies on, on some, on that. There's, there's no pharmaceutical company who cares, who wants to research that. And so the, the old psych literature does just kind of depict it as this [00:25:00] inability to let go of, of literally of the semen, but also let go of, you know, of the 

Allen Silver: psychological mood.

Yeah. Oh my God. So what comes to mind when you talk about that is that this is a,  kind of people. A lot of guys have a script when they come in to spend time with me and,  felt you can S you can end the place very clear that they're very close to,  coming and it's,  it's totally appropriate if they choose to do so.

And then suddenly how much time do we have left? No, no, no, don't go there. It's like, if you feel like it, do it, if you don't feel like it, do it, that's the role don't, you know, It's sticks. Cause then lo and behold, if you try and hold back and do it, then you're performing, then you're, you know, making it about something other than what your inner desire is.

Tim Norton: Yeah. And I bet you could almost see something shift in their body. Right. When they say that the, how much time do we have left, right? Yes. Yes. And there, 

Allen Silver: I don't there's little part inside of me. It's like, damn it. Oh, I do. In that play [00:26:00] space and you popped out of it. Right. But then I bring them to it because now they're back in their head and I, you know, that's, that's a conscious learning that can be useful,  in the future for them to realize that they're doing that.

I think it's giving the permission to just go ahead and enjoy it when they felt like enjoying it. You know, I give him permission to do that. It's 

Tim Norton: a teachable moment 

Allen Silver: to change.

Tim Norton:  I,  I read, I read a couple of the things on your website and I like to quote, I think it was, I think it was maybe Robin found it. I have learned that expanding my own joy and pleasure is not selfish. It creates more of it for the whole world. Hmm. Can you talk a little bit more about that? Are you quoting somebody or is that, is that Allen silver.

All right. That does 

Allen Silver: sound good. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I, I think people have a kind of a [00:27:00] scarcity approach to a lot of things in life and they, by default somehow use that kind of approach when it's about, you know,  enjoying themselves and,  I'm all in supportive. Being a shameless enjoyer of lots and lots of sex,  have guys who feel guilty about,  their sex drive, being so high.

 and,  I just know for me, I kept myself so repressed for a long time. And then when I wasn't,  it seemed almost too big to handle and I just wanted to go out and have sex with the world. So,  I'd never want to shame somebody if they're in that space and,  Do you know, there's more,  we'll make more, remember the, you know, the Doritos ads, like, you know, go out there and have enjoyment.

It's not like it's a limited resource we're going to run out of,  by making it, you make more. 

Tim Norton: Hmm. And so do you feel like you were, [00:28:00] sometimes I try and teach people how to embody joy, you know, like I think about where they hold joy in their bodies and, and what it actually looks like. 

Allen Silver: Oh, good for you.

That's 

Tim Norton: so cool. Yeah. I love that. You know, we all kind of know what we feel. I feel like somatically with shame and with fear, you know, we spent so much time talking about, okay, where do you hold your fear? And it's in your gut, but it's also important to think about where you hold love and joy. And I think,  I'm wondering, you know, when I read the quote, I was wondering like, if, if you being more joyful in your erotic space or spaces is, is,  contagious.

Allen Silver: Absolutely. Yes. I'm sure you've experienced that being around somebody who's well, who's alive and lit up and is enjoying their life. It's contagious, you know, to say the same around being somebody who's a downer and depressed and looking at everything in a crappy way.  I call it the,  I call it the bug light.

So, if you can [00:29:00] find the thing that lights you up, it's kind of a bad metaphor, but I'm stuck with it because I've been saying it so long, but you know, when you find the thing that brings you joy, when you're lit up and what makes you feel most alive,  you dislike this light that is attractive, you know,  doubt.

And I just love helping people,  find that it's also,  it elicits trust in people when you're that way.  I've I, in an odd way, I'm think I'm more vulnerable when I'm in that joy space, because I will just say things are blurred out things that are unfeeling,  from an honest place when people can sense that and it allows them to do that as well.

Tim Norton: Yeah. Well, it reminds me of dancing, you know, I, I know I never liked the people who make fun of you for dancing because you're in that joyous state where you don't want to care what everybody's thinking about. And then to tie that into sex, like it. Sometimes it's really hard to [00:30:00] embody the joy of the experience if you're just so preoccupied by the performance or by the other person's pleasure.

Allen Silver: I love it. Yeah. 

Tim Norton: And just trying to let go of that.  Do you, do you find the same to be true? 

Allen Silver: I do. I just want to say, you know, in terms of that, like,  my previous statement about the guy doing the cock sucking as if he had the same way, seen it on porn, it's like, you know, w what is it dance as if no one is watching and talk as if psychotic is, if no one is watching, you know, just get into it and don't care about how stupid it was.

Yeah. That your partner is gonna have a great time. Yeah. So are we we're allowed to say that on this show, 

Tim Norton: right? Yeah, I think so. I, I put them up on iTunes and then so far they haven't taken them down. I don't know if I'm supposed to put a disclaimer at the beginning of it. It will. We'll find out [00:31:00] one day I may have a lot of editing to do.

 but for now it's fine. So, you know, BV, I know. You're you're saying you don't need a hard cock to have a good time.  but what about those times when you, do you know, what, what do you, what do you tell guys? 

Allen Silver: Well, it depends on the guy in the situation, but,  I try to circumnavigate their heads, so getting them into a place of play and also,  There are still some shirts around, cause sometimes there's guys who just really, they think they should be wanting to be a top and they just really honestly don't care about it that much.

 but okay. To answer your question,  I finesse him into it is the best I can say. And I haven't been a hundred percent successful with that.  I try to shy away from it being,  like a, a technical thing. [00:32:00]  you know, Oh, maybe see the, you know, of course, I assume they've already dealt with this in terms of medical issues and stuff.

 but what will often happen to him? And we'll get into a space where they go ahead and get an erection and don't even know it because we've gone to another place and are too,  we're two kids on a camp out, you know, having fun and, and it, it happens. And then,  if they have a specific agenda around what they want to do with their Dick, I will just do it,   jump on it, so to speak and,  give them a chance to experience what that's like until they suddenly realize what's happening.

And then it becomes a conscious thing again, but it made a little tiny,  connection in a neuron somewhere. And so I'm always looking for little pieces of progress, you know, not giant breakthroughs. And so I can,  Say at the end of the session now let's review. And do you remember what happened? Do you remember how that happened?

Because they'll go back into there, like on the failure space and I'll remind them of, but you remember that moment, you remember what happened? You weren't thinking about [00:33:00] it. Right. And then you did get a boner and then we did do this thing and. Just remember that happened. Remind yourself about that. And then sit on that.

Like what, what made that possible so that sometimes can help them get to a better place. You know, there's a lot of old programming in their brain, you know, about how crappy a lover they are. I'm a failure because my Dick isn't get hard enough. And,  you're looking for ways to build new neural pathways around that good experiences.

I'm always trying to get put good experiences in there to give them another point of view. 

Tim Norton: Okay. It sounds like they're, they're coming to the room, almost playing a role that they play every single time and kind of telling themselves the same thing. And you're, you're breaking them out of that. You say you're, you're finessing the situation.

So it's like you're distracting them, but also by them not so being so preoccupied by the situation they're relaxing. 

Allen Silver: Yeah. As a matter of fact, you say roles it's actually [00:34:00] beneficial because we are enrolls when someone's coming to me in a session, it's a form of role play, even if I'm just there as their sex educator.

So,  they're off the hook to some degree in the same way that they would be if they had picked somebody up in a bar and,  therefore they're willing to take orders a little more and,  listen to me.  But, you know, you have, you have like three things that make a good sex. So you have three possible avenues.

And if you can get all three of them go on at once, it's really hot, but there's a role-play, which could be where lovers could be, you know,    your sacred, intimate, and your client could be a lot, could be, you know, gladiator and slave boy.  and you have,   the erotic trance. Which is a type of connection that is not requiring eyesight.

It's about the touch. It's about the feeling. And then you have the , which is like, you're looking in each other's eyes and you're having [00:35:00] a kind of connection that way. And if you can get all three of those going at once,  it'll usually send you to a really good place. And most men are not able or willing to do all three at once.

So that's one of my. My middle secrets. I'm letting you in on there. That's a 

Tim Norton: great secret.  can you talk more like when,  for listeners we're, we're on a Skype call and when he said I vow, he kind of pointed at his eyes and then at my eyes,  what's, what's going on in, in Idaho. 

Allen Silver: So,  as both an icebreaker, a connector and it can be challenging.

 well you usually start a session. By standing across from a man, especially if he's nervous putting our hands on each other's hearts and just breathing together. And then I will, I will look in his eyes and try to get him to look in mine. If he is hesitant to all try to gently coax him into doing that.

And if you look in another person's eyes [00:36:00] and breathe for 30 seconds, or even a minute, something always happens. And then I take,  then I asked them to check in with their body and I check them with mine and I am always seeking to be completely honest with them. Whatever's going on with me.  and now you're inside a really beautiful container when you've done all that.

So that's the out part in terms of opening the session. 

Tim Norton: Okay. Then that sounds really wonderful. You know, I, what I hear from a lot of people is. A lack of eye contact during sex. And a lot of people are blaming porn on that, but I, you know, I think it's been happening for just maybe just more, a lack of sex education and not being so good at being intimate and vulnerable.

So your icebreaker is, is diving right into it. A vulnerability or an intimacy that a lot of people don't get to experience. 

Allen Silver: Okay. Which part is conscious and which part is not conscious. So you [00:37:00] could consciously not be doing eye contact in order to have a deeper experience. Maybe you want to go deeper into this sensation.

Maybe you want to go deeper into the role play. And that involves being blindfolded. So that's a different, that's like choosing not to do it for that reason. So I don't wanna get anybody hung up on. You should always maintain eye contact all the time. You're having sex, but don't avoid it. If it's keeping you from being connected.

Tim Norton: Oh, that's a great distinction. Okay. And, and,  so there was role-play and I though, what was the middle one?  

Allen Silver: erotic trance. That's where your friends, that's just, that's just about being in sensation. So,  you know, when I think of it, I think of being in a, in a, in a sex club with a really dark lighting and just, you know, someone is touching you and you can't see them and you just didn't join the touch.

And,  it's, it's that kind of feeling. 

Tim Norton: Okay. And I, and not feeling you're not preoccupied with. [00:38:00] Is the other person enjoying this. 

Allen Silver: That's an interest I'd never thought of it that way.  you could be it, but you're talking about being in a give and taking situation.  yeah. Yeah. I honestly have not thought about it that way.

 you know, in order to enjoy sex, you need to be a little selfish, you know, you can get what you want and ask for what you want and just enjoy it. When you get it. So if you're always trying to, you know, what drives me crazy is when you're with somebody and you ask them what they want and they said, I want to please you now, unless it's, you know, that's a role-play and that's a specific purpose around, that's a different server, but otherwise it's like now, now you're just throwing it back at me, you know?

So,  that's really curious when someone says it like, Oh, so you can't name anything in this moment that would make this feel better for you. And just bringing their attention to that. Yeah. Oh, okay. Maybe I [00:39:00] can't. Okay. 

Tim Norton: That's a great reply. You can't think of anything in this moment, 

Allen Silver: right. And also the power of, no, you got to give people permission to say no, you know, that's a lot that goes on a lot too.

Cause it's just tolerating stuff that they don't like. And you know, that's keeping them from being turned on. It's like, you know, I really don't care for that. Stop that. I have a lot of rules around how people can touch my nipples. And I tell them that up front. 

Tim Norton: So my, my last guest and this interview isn't up yet, but she was a tantric practitioner and she felt like she could tell a lot of guys were masturbating to porn a lot, and it was spilling over into our work.

It was making sessions longer, people being desensitized, people behaving differently. Do you, do you pick up on any of that and your client 

Allen Silver: work? You do? I do. And I have, I have some,  homework around masturbation, which is, I believe in masturbating as much as you [00:40:00] care to.  but I required that 50% of it be,  without any form of porn and just whatever you create in your head.

Okay. Cause that's actually, if you can get by yourself and just do something, you can come up with stuff, you know, It's it's just pot, Reno. You could make up a story in your head. You can touch yourself, but all of that is coming from whatever's going on inside of you instead of the external bombardment.

Because I mean, as you probably know that the it's one thing to flip through a magazine and in the old days, like we did, but now you can just like have a continuous fast feed of one thing after another, and it's totally desensitizing it's too much. 

Tim Norton: And how do you see that play out in a session or what.

What evidence do you see of, of guys just watching way too much porn? Why does it affect them?

Allen Silver: I would say just to kind of,  like a weak muscle, like how, you know, when you do an exercise and you have a weak muscle, so [00:41:00] you just are not very good at being able to connect the genuine playful way with another guy.  I don't know that I've ever found somebody where it's totally lost,   Well would say something about that in a second, but in terms of watching too much porn, it's still possible to get, it's just, you know, it's just a matter of getting back in the habit of doing that exercise of, you know, getting masturbating to what turns you on without any external stimulation, something will show up for you when you do that.

Guys may find that it goes into a romantic space. Like, you know, they're just dreaming of the perfect lover or some, you know, fantasy rape scene or whatever thing goes on in their head. But,  you know, It's back there. You just gotta give it a chance to emerge. I did want to say that one time. I do have a hard time.

I can't say I've had a lot of success with is with guys who are,  have become,  disconnected from their own pleasure due to a drug use. And that's another area I'm not an expert in, so yeah. Okay. 

[00:42:00] Tim Norton: And mainly like, like math or just, yeah, that's what I'm thinking of. Yeah. Like over too much math in sex and.

And sex is very different without 

Allen Silver: math. Yes. Yeah. So getting back down to the, you know, mundane world after doing it that way, I think it's really challenging for them. Uh it's it's that's always, that's a hard 

Tim Norton: one. Yeah. Yeah. There was actually a seminar on that recently at the center for healthy sex on, on sex aftermath.

It was,  I still haven't watched it. I mentioned, yeah, 

Allen Silver: I'll say I'll send them to you if I get people. Okay. Okay, 

Tim Norton: great. Yeah, I'm the expert.  So I also, do you have regulars? Do you, do you have clients that you have long-term,  treatment with or connections with that you work with multiple times? 

Allen Silver: Yes.

Tim Norton: You know, I, I know that in therapy, when, in those situations and even in short-term situations, sometimes I learn from them [00:43:00] and, you know, we're, we're constantly learning about sexuality and, and, and I mean, that's such a broad. Thing on itself. We're, we're learning a lot about sexuality.  do you, are you learning from your clients too sometimes?

Like, what are the, some of the things, what have you learned about 

Allen Silver: for college

patients?   allowing,  trusting the moment and,  you know, I've had somebody come in for something. And I thought we'd be done lickety split and half them out the door. And it was clear that it was going to take a very long time.  and I've had the opposite where,  somebody just had this idea in their head that this was going to be this huge, challenging thing.

 but what you got to remember sometimes is by the point somebody comes in to see someone like me, they've already gone through a big process. So. Their session, so to speak has been going on for [00:44:00] awhile. And sometimes I'm just the final step in that the actual showing up and being in front of this person and gathering the courage to do the thing they wanted to do.

So they may have thought that was going to take them six months to do in terms of two took suit one day or two sessions. Hmm. Hmm. 

Tim Norton: That's really interesting. And you've worked with,  sometimes you'll work with people who are actually physically disabled. 

Allen Silver: Yes. I've had a lot of it, you know, it's, it's, it's I, I was thinking about this the other day.

They seem to have come in,  waves of things. So for a while, there are ahead to see a lot of guys who were,  had,  various prostate situations. And there's, you know, there's a lot of guys who have to relearn how to have sex after having prostate surgery.  and I've had a while there, I had several guys in a row that were different types of amputees.

 as a wheelchair bound clients,  I've never had a [00:45:00] blind client, which I think is interesting. I've had deaf clients.  yeah, it's an honor to work with people like that, you know, just like you can bring,   some level of hypersexuality to their lives. It just like what, how wonderful. 

Tim Norton: Yeah. And I know that,  the, with prostate.

Cancer and prostate surgery. That's, it's always,  it's always tricky because the guys are dealing with doctors and, you know, urologists and so forth, who I find to be fairly often pretty sex negative. And I always, you know, they're often told, Hey, you're never going to have sex again, or you're always going to struggle.

 so I'm really happy to hear that you're, you're seeing those guys come through and, and, and you've had some success. 

Allen Silver: Yes. And, [00:46:00]  a number of things. It's just, there's a lot of stuff that can happen when you've had a prostate surgery.  and one of them is that it changes the way your acceleration happens.

And then they can also like be more leaky in this kind of prosthetic fluid and urine. And they can, they have shame around that. So I can work with them to shift that,  And just accept that that's the way it is. And it actually can actually be kind of hot, you know, and I'm sure there's a lot of people that are turned on by that.

 so,  it, it physically changes you and there's also the mental aspect. You're talking about doctors just telling them yep. It's over. You know, and it's just beyond what I hear that it's like, it's not totally over. There's something, even if you're caucus and capable of ever getting hard, again, there's some kind of erotic enjoyment you're going to be able to have, and let's find out what that is, how fun it would be to find out what that is.

You know, look at it that way and mourn the loss of what [00:47:00] was, I can't pretend everything's hunky Dory. And so 

Tim Norton: what are some of the pleasures of a non-hard. Cock, whether it's medical or just so much damn stress the last few months of their 

Allen Silver: lives, like, well, obviously it's still fun to have your cock sock when it's soft.

 you also can move it in certain ways. You can't, it's hard for vibrations and wiggling, things like that.  and then, you know, of course I work with gay men, so there's a whole world of enjoyment to be had,  with your asshole.  As a matter of fact, I even have a hard time having erection if they're bottoming and that's normal.

So then he's let go of thinking. They're supposed to be hard all the time. Then they can have,  an internal orgasm, you know, she's not required hard cock. You can have whole lot of bodywork essence by, you know, spreading that or riding energy around it. It's like your whole body is a penis when you're [00:48:00] like that.

So,  Yeah. There's some examples. Yeah. 

Tim Norton: And, you know,  anecdotal evidence out there that,  prostate massage can help with erectile issues. Or if you found any of that along the way, or know anybody who's, who's good at that or any, 

Allen Silver: I haven't approached it for that reason.  yeah. Let me think if I can think of.

I think, I can't think of it being connected to someone coming in, being concerned about direction. And then, you know, I have admin be surprised that they get an erection during prostatic prostrate and slash, and actually ejaculating the traditional sense during the prostate massage, which they were surprised by.

 and that happened like a 

Tim Norton: gum. Yeah. That happens fairly regularly or, or more often than I think a lot of people might think, 

Allen Silver: right.  [00:49:00] no,  I don't have a basis of comparison for that.  so for it to happen in a, in a way, because there's, I've been with a number of guys that are like that, but they already know they're like that.

It's just like, Oh, this is how I am.  but I'd say over the past 12, 18 years, like maybe half a dozen times it's happened by surprise. Okay. So from whatever numbers that were sent to. 

Tim Norton: Okay. Yeah. But even for the guys who know about it yeah.  I just think,  especially in the straight world, don't know that from anal play alone, you can evacuate.

Allen Silver: It's that's a beautiful thing. I don't know. It's all it's always happened for me just as a circuit. Is this as a by-product of the pleasure?  never set out, trying to do that, like to train someone to do that. I don't know if there's a way to do that. Okay. Sophia, a fun thing to take out though. 

Tim Norton: Life goal.

Yeah. All right. So are there at [00:50:00] that hour, just kind of flew by. Wow. I feel like we could talk about all kinds of stuff.  was there any other things that you felt like you want the world to know? And,  my, my mom to know and listening to this podcast, though, the guys on my football team. 

Allen Silver:  yeah, there's a little thing around it kind of touched on, which is, I think your cock has wisdom.

And a few years back,  I was at a ceremony and we were making intentions that I decided that I wanted to have an intention of letting go of my own concerns around having an erection. And,  then I had to learn to trust that my Dick had,  some wisdom to itself. And if I'm,  in a situation and I am, I'm having trouble getting an erection.

The first thing I do is like, well, what's going on here? That's not working for me. And sometimes I have to be honest with like, [00:51:00] there's nothing in this situation that's turning me on. So that's the word is,  yeah, but other times it's like, you don't really tolerate. And so me, I don't want to be tolerating.

I'm just going to go and tell this guy that his bad breath is killing me. I wouldn't say killing me. It'd be book life in that, but that's an example. And, and in trusting your Dick rather than demanding it to do things my early,  I remember it in the James Bond movies when I was a kid that James Bond was just walking into a room with a sexy girl and BAMMIES screener, you know, it's like, I, I felt like such a loser as a kid.

Like I can never do that. It was such a terrible role model to get as a kid.  And now I've learned the joys of the, all of the many shades of erections that Cox can have

Tim Norton: with that. That would almost be a runner up title for the podcast.  the Dick has wisdom that's so, so [00:52:00] profound and simple, but so true. 

Allen Silver: Well, you know, you gotta make your Dick, your friend, you know, if it's, how are you going to learn wisdom? If you're on not a speaking terms. And if you're mad at your Dick all the time, then you know, there will, there we go.

We've got to start there. Yeah. Yeah. 

Tim Norton: It'd be nice. Your Dick give it what it wants, 

Allen Silver: but I mean, do you have a nickname for your Dick? 

Tim Norton: No. No, I don't. That's time. 

Allen Silver: Is this a question? I it's, this is,   Avenue to playfulness. I will do it as I'll talk, ask us if they have a nickname for their day. Which one you, they come up or they can come up with it, but you can't help, but get you in a silly space.

And now are you stepped away from the seriousness, right? We're a little bit closer to being kids playing together. 

Tim Norton: And yeah. And then you talked about,  forming new neural pathways, you know, you're accessing the creative part of your brain and you know, as long as you're not now worried about not coming up with a clever.

Pet name. So yeah, you might do that. I don't know. I don't want to 

Allen Silver: see the wheels spinning too much. I'd I'd [00:53:00] have them back off. Yeah. Right. Okay. 

Tim Norton: And that's, what's nice about working with someone like yourself in a hands-on situation is you're going to very quickly be able to read that and say, okay, that wasn't a good idea.

That's not working. Let's, let's move over here and let's try 

Allen Silver: it. Yeah. I don't want to be too arrogant about that because I don't assume I always read things right.  I've had situations where,  somebody will be behaving in a way that it looks to me, like they're shutting down. And so I gotta remind myself not to assume I know what's going on.

And so hopefully we'll see. I don't always do this perfectly. Hopefully I'll stop in and say,  you know, I noticed you kind of got quiet and look like you're looking away and. And then give them a chance to be wherever they're at and respond because it may be yes, they had checkout or maybe it's happened quite a few times.

Wow. Something just came up for me. We need to go a different direction. Here's this [00:54:00] blah, blah, blah. And you're like, you're off to the races. So,  gotta trust the moment and not assume, you know, what's going on. Oh, 

Tim Norton: that's great. And then what a nice thing for. For, for a couple to model, you know, one partner doing that and just kind of checking in and then, you know, obviously they're the partner doing that too.

 but not making assumptions, having hard conversations. Wow. That 

Allen Silver: would be awesome. And,  yeah. Would be 

Tim Norton: great. Right. Especially over the course of a long-term relationship. You, you have those kinds of conversations. I love it. I noticed you kind of checked out right there and yeah. Cause I wanted to leave me alone and other times.

Yeah, no, I didn't even realize doing that. 

Allen Silver: Thanks for pointing out now. I would just caution you to say Nazi. I checked out. I didn't, that I would say that something happened and I, I don't understand, you know, give them a chance to paint their own words, but yeah. Yeah. Okay. Say 

Tim Norton: Monday. Yeah, [00:55:00] that is all right.

Well, this has been a blast. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you, 

Allen Silver: Tim. You're a cool guy. Such a pleasure to talk to you. 

Tim Norton: Yeah, absolutely. Is there any, anything we can plug for you?  where, where can people find you on the interwebs and social media and all that? 

Allen Silver: Sure.   my secret intimate side is Allen SSI.

That's Allen spelled a pretty way. A L L E N S I.com and,  my site it's more about my,  adult film work is Allen silver. And I am working on a book, but I am not ready to,  plump that yet. But,  you know, I think we have got a chance to plug that later on your show. 

Tim Norton: Oh, absolutely. Be sure. To put me on the list of people interested in when that book comes out.

Really cool. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. All right, Allen. Well, thank you so much for your time. Thank 

Allen Silver: you. [00:57:00] [00:56:00] .